Discussion

jgbuddy: This is huge, long time coming. Interested to see if there is SwiftUI support.

nielsbot: What type of support do you mean? Language checking? Live previews?

MaysonL: Is there an open—source Swift IDE that can modify itself without restarting? (written in Swift) I loved Oberon µSystems Oberon/F aka Component Pascal for that capability.Or am I going to have to vibe-code one.

hyzyla: No so straightforward, but there is project that parses xcodebuild logs and pass them to lsp to provide LSP for SwiftUI projects https://github.com/SolaWing/xcode-build-serverAlso I build extra tooling to facilitate iOS development in VSCode https://github.com/sweetpad-dev/sweetpad

sunnybeetroot: Thanks for your great work on sweetpad. I’ve always been a bit curious where the name came from though.

hbn: Now if only they'd open up iOS development so we can get AppCode back.The primary thing keeping me away from trying it again is I have to use Xcode instead of my beloved JetBrains IDEs where I know all the keyboard shortcuts.

castral: The loss of AppCode from Jetbrains was a huge blow to my motivation to continue working with Swift. Xcode just can't compare.

rockbruno: This extension is for "pure" Swift development, not iOS development. I doubt the latter will ever officially happen. It's possible to make it work for iOS at an unofficial capacity though by hooking into the extension's LSP support. We did this at Spotify to enable iOS development in Cursor for Bazel iOS projects: https://github.com/spotify/sourcekit-bazel-bsp

worldsavior: You also can't do Android (app) development outside Android Studio.

tadfisher: That's just untrue on the face of it. All of the build tools are open and cross-platform. Is there a specific piece of Android Studio that you require for Android app development?

manwe150: Not certain if this answers the question, but it seemed like you're generally expected to install Android Studio to get the correct build versions of all of the tools and libraries. I guess theoretically you could repackage them yourself, but also not entirely clear why you would—other than perhaps download size. The tools can be driven externally, once installed, but so could XCode projects (with `xcodebuild`).

cyberax: Incorrect. You can (if you really want to) build an Android app without having any Google tools.But even if you don't want to do any crazy stuff, Android SDK itself is just a bunch of Gradle scripts and Java apps. You can download and install them without any GUI in the way.This is very common in CI/CD environments. Google provides a handy tool for that: https://developer.android.com/toolsSorry, but Android and iOS are simply incomparable in their quality. Android SDK is a high-quality tool for developers that provides all the expected interfaces.iOS SDK is a lock-in GUI hell that requires you to use a shitty macOS-only tool to even _upload_ apps to Apple Store. Never mind doing headless builds in CI/CD.

doctorpangloss: on the other hand, when many of the best programmers haven't looked at a line of code in months, will it matter?

randomNumber7: I think swift is a really great language from the design perspective.What makes it unusable outside the apple ecosystem imho is that while the C interop is amazing on paper, it sucks hard in practice due to the abomination of pointer types they build in.The "all pointers are evil" attitude doesn't help when you want to use a C library and noone will write rewrite all these libraries.

tracymiranda: Some recent fixes went into 6.2.3 which really help with C interop, this post shows what that looks like in practice https://www.swift.org/blog/improving-usability-of-c-librarie...

tadfisher: This is not an expectation, no. Libraries are managed via Gradle or whatever build system you use. Android-specific host tools are Gradle-managed, installed via the sdkmanager tool, or managed via other means; I maintain a repository to install them via Nix [0], and many Linux distributions package them. The Android Studio IDE is not required, and doing so would pretty much break everyone's CI setup.[0]: https://github.com/tadfisher/android-nixpkgs